Imagine the heartbreak of losing a loved one not to illness or accident, but to the invisible struggles of mental health and addiction—a tragedy that hits home for too many families. The shocking murders of filmmaker Rob Reiner and his wife, Michele Singer Reiner, allegedly at the hands of their son Nick, have sparked heartfelt conversations across the nation about these tough challenges. Drawing from his own painful journey, Virginia State Senator Creigh Deeds joins us to share insights. His 24-year-old son, Gus, who battled severe bipolar disorder, tragically assaulted him before ending his own life. Journalist William Brangham recently interviewed Deeds, and their discussion sheds light on these issues. Remember, these transcripts are created by both machines and humans, with minor edits for clarity—there might be a few hiccups along the way.
William Brangham:
The tragic killings of director Rob Reiner and his spouse Michele Singer Reiner, reportedly committed by their son Nick, have reignited tough dialogues nationwide for families grappling with mental illness and substance addiction. Nick's challenges were widely known—severe health episodes, multiple stints in rehab for drug use, and recent whispers of schizophrenia treatment. While the full story of the Reiner family remains unclear, it's evident that mental health issues and addiction pose immense hurdles, even for those with resources. To dive deeper, we're chatting with Virginia State Senator Creigh Deeds, who faced this nightmare firsthand. In 2013, his 24-year-old son Gus, long tormented by bipolar disorder, attacked his dad before sadly taking his own life.
Senator, we're truly grateful for your presence and openness on such a sensitive subject.
First off, it's crucial to note—and I know you're aware—that individuals with mental illnesses aren't naturally prone to violence. In fact, they're far more often the targets of harm than the ones causing it.
Senator Creigh Deeds (D-VA):
Exactly right.
William Brangham:
Still, upon learning about the alleged events in the Reiner household, how did that land with you?
Senator Creigh Deeds:
It filled me with sorrow for the family—grief over the loss of these remarkable individuals and the fact that their son couldn't access the support he desperately needed. Mental health is so often misunderstood, and for years, we've let shame build a barrier that blocks people from seeking help. It also reminded me of the uphill battle of caring for a grown child. Even after they hit 18, they're still your kid in so many ways, but securing services is a real ordeal. As the old proverb goes, you can guide a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink—and the same applies when coaxing someone into treatment.
William Brangham:
Let's explore that further. We don't have all the details on Nick Reiner's situation, but it's common knowledge that mental health problems and substance abuse frequently overlap.
Could you elaborate on the obstacles you encountered while trying to secure care for your son, Gus?
Senator Creigh Deeds:
Looking back, it's been years, but the core issue persists: many people in this position fail to recognize their illness or refuse to acknowledge it. They resist certain steps or treatments. For an adult child, you might need to persuade them to seek voluntary help, or if that's not possible, pursue involuntary measures that require some court involvement to grant you decision-making power. It's hurdle after hurdle. In Gus's case, we fought to help him see his problems and accept treatment. Unfortunately, in his final moments of illness and confusion, he rejected it entirely. This isn't something to joke about—it's incredibly grueling.
William Brangham:
You're pointing out that once someone reaches 18, parents legally lose control due to medical privacy and personal rights.
Senator Creigh Deeds:
Spot on. Under both federal and state laws, individuals gain independence as early as 14 in some areas—they can choose not to follow recommended treatments. I longed for Gus to get the care he needed and exhausted every option to guide him toward it. But he declined, and that's a common outcome.
William Brangham:
Following your family's loss, you contributed to a Virginia commission examining flaws in mental health services—that was over a decade back. How has progress fared in your state and across the country? Are we making strides compared to then?
Senator Creigh Deeds:
We've improved, no doubt, but the truth is, we've ignored this problem for so long that there's still mountains of work ahead. While recovering in the hospital after Gus's attack and subsequent death—lasting several days—I reflected deeply. Being a legislator gave me a platform to drive change. I had more questions than solutions, so we formed a commission to investigate mental health gaps. That group, meeting for about eight or nine years, evolved into the Virginia Behavioral Health Commission—a permanent body with staff researching strategies for tackling these disorders. In Virginia, we've poured hundreds of millions annually into expanding public mental health services, boosting the required offerings for community boards from just two to nine. Our focus is preventing crises before they escalate. We've achieved some victories, and I'm proud, yet there's plenty more to accomplish.
William Brangham:
The Reiner family openly shared their experiences, even producing a movie based on Nick's journey. You, being in politics at the time, couldn't step back from discussing it. But many families still wrestle with deep shame, guilt, and reluctance to speak out or seek aid. How prevalent is this stigma nowadays?
Senator Creigh Deeds:
It's still a massive barrier. Daily, families face tragedies, but most aren't splashed across headlines. We need compassion and kindness toward those enduring this. Historically, stigma has walled off mental health, discouraging people from admitting issues or pursuing help out of embarrassment. We're chipping away at those walls gradually. For instance, a few years ago, Virginia integrated mental health education into public school health curricula for eighth and ninth graders—crucial because around 70% of serious mental illnesses first surface between ages 14 and 24. By equipping young people with awareness of symptoms and red flags during this vulnerable period, we're aiming to empower them.
But here's where it gets controversial: Mental health is physical health too. The brain is an organ like any other, and treating mental illness as legitimate healthcare is essential. It's okay to feel down or struggle—yet society often perpetuates myths with terms like "crazy." We fundraise passionately for conditions like breast cancer, but mental health lags behind. Changing our language and mindset can dismantle stigma. We must ensure communities offer accessible treatment so people can heal. And this is the part most people miss: True progress requires systemic shifts, not just awareness.
William Brangham:
That wraps up our chat with Virginia State Senator Creigh Deeds.
Senator, thank you for your time and valuable perspectives.
Senator Creigh Deeds:
My pleasure. Take care.
What are your thoughts on this? Do you believe parents should retain more authority over adult children's mental health choices, even if it challenges personal autonomy? Or is the current emphasis on individualism the right path? Is stigma truly fading, or do we still have far to go? Share your opinions in the comments—let's discuss and maybe even spark some change!
